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SubjectRe: Introspecting userns relationships to other namespaces?
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On Thu, 2016-07-07 at 08:36 -0500, Serge E. Hallyn wrote:
> Quoting Michael Kerrisk (man-pages) (mtk.manpages@gmail.com):
> > Hi Serge,
> >
> > On 6 July 2016 at 16:13, Serge E. Hallyn <serge@hallyn.com> wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jul 06, 2016 at 10:41:48AM +0200, Michael Kerrisk (man
> > > -pages) wrote:
> > > > [Rats! Doing now what I should have down to start with. Looping
> > > > some lists and CRIU and other possibly relevant people into
> > > > this conversation]
> > > >
> > > > Hi Eric,
> > > >
> > > > On 5 July 2016 at 23:47, Eric W. Biederman <
> > > > ebiederm@xmission.com> wrote:
> > > > > "Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" <mtk.manpages@gmail.com>
> > > > > writes:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hi Eric,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have a question. Is there any way currently to discover
> > > > > > which user namespace a particular nonuser namespace is
> > > > > > governed by? Maybe I am missing something, but there does
> > > > > > not seem to be a way to do this. Also, can one discover
> > > > > > which userns is the parent of a given userns? Again, I
> > > > > > can't see a way to do this.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The point here is introspecting so that a process might
> > > > > > determine what its capabilities are when operating on some
> > > > > > resource governed by a (nonuser) namespace.
> > > > >
> > > > > To the best of my knowledge that there is not an interface to
> > > > > get that information. It would be good to have such an
> > > > > interface for no other reason than the CRIU folks are going
> > > > > to need it at some point. I am a bit surprised they have not
> > > > > complained yet.
> > >
> > > I don't think they need it. They do in fact have what they need.
> > > Assume you have tasks T1, T2, T1_1 and T2_1; T1 and T2 are in
> > > init_user_ns; T1 spawned T1_1 in a new userns; T2 spawned T2_1
> > > which setns()d to T1_1's ns. There's some {handwave} uid mapping,
> > > does not matter.
> > >
> > > At restart, it doesn't matter which task originally created the
> > > new userns. criu knows T1_1 and T2_1 are in the same userns; it
> > > creates the userns, sets up the mapping, and T1_1 and T2_1
> > > setns() to it.
> >
> > I'm missing something here. How does the parental relationships
> > between the user namespaces get reconstructed? Those relationships
> > will govern what capabilities a process will have in various user
> > namespaces.

Actually, you get the parent namespace from the process tree by
tracking the user namespaces of the parent pids. Currently non-root
users can't bind the namespace, so the only way to keep a new user_ns
around if you're not root is to keep the process around, so for
multiply nested user namespaces you can usually build the user_ns
hierarchy by looking at the process hierarchy. Conversely, if the
process is reparented to init, chances are that the user_ns is also
parented to init_user_ns.

> Hm. Probably best-effort based on the process hierarchy. So yeah
> you could probably get a tree into a state that would be wrongly
> recreated. Create a new netns, bind mount it, exit; Have another
> task create a new user_ns, bind mount it, exit; Third task setns()s
> first to the new netns then to the new user_ns. I suspect criu will
> recreate that wrongly.

This is a bit pathological, and you have to be root to do it: so root
can set up a nesting hierarchy, bind it and destroy the pids but I know
of no current orchestration system which does this.

Actually, I have to back pedal a bit: the way I currently set up
architecture emulation containers does precisely this: I set up the
namespaces unprivileged with child mount namespaces, but then I ask
root to bind the userns and kill the process that created it so I have
a permanent handle to enter the namespace by, so I suspect that when
our current orchestration systems get more sophisticated, they might
eventually want to do something like this as well.

In theory, we could get nsfs to show this information as an option
(just add a show_options entry to the superblock ops), but the problem
is that although each namespace has a parent user_ns, there's no way to
get it without digging in the namespace specific structure. Probably
we should restructure to move it into ns_common, then we could display
it (and enforce all namespaces having owning user_ns) but it would be a
reasonably large (but mechanical) change.

James

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