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SubjectRe: [RFC v2 3/7] powerpc: atomic: Implement atomic{,64}_{add,sub}_return_* variants
On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 02:29:04PM -0700, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 23, 2015 at 08:07:55AM +0800, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > On Tue, Sep 22, 2015 at 08:25:40AM -0700, Paul E. McKenney wrote:
> > > On Tue, Sep 22, 2015 at 07:37:04AM +0800, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > > > On Tue, Sep 22, 2015 at 07:26:56AM +0800, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > > > > On Mon, Sep 21, 2015 at 11:24:27PM +0100, Will Deacon wrote:
> > > > > > Hi Boqun,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Sun, Sep 20, 2015 at 09:23:03AM +0100, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > > > > > > On Sat, Sep 19, 2015 at 11:33:10PM +0800, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 05:59:02PM +0100, Will Deacon wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 16, 2015 at 04:49:31PM +0100, Boqun Feng wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On powerpc, we don't need a general memory barrier to achieve acquire and
> > > > > > > > > > release semantics, so __atomic_op_{acquire,release} can be implemented
> > > > > > > > > > using "lwsync" and "isync".
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I'm assuming isync+ctrl isn't transitive, so we need to get to the bottom
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Actually the transitivity is still guaranteed here, I think ;-)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The litmus test I'm thinking of is:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > {
> > > > > > 0:r2=x;
> > > > > > 1:r2=x; 1:r5=z;
> > > > > > 2:r2=z; 2:r4=x;
> > > > > > }
> > > > > > P0 | P1 | P2 ;
> > > > > > li r1,1 | lwz r1,0(r2) | lwz r1,0(r2) ;
> > > > > > stw r1,0(r2) | cmpw r1,r1 | cmpw r1,r1 ;
> > > > > > | beq LC00 | beq LC01 ;
> > > > > > | LC00: | LC01: ;
> > > > > > | isync | isync ;
> > > > > > | li r4,1 | lwz r3,0(r4) ;
> > > > > > | stw r4,0(r5) | ;
> > > > > > exists
> > > > > > (1:r1=1 /\ 2:r1=1 /\ 2:r3=0)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Which appears to be allowed. I don't think you need to worry about backwards
> > > > > > branches for the ctrl+isync construction (none of the current example do,
> > > > > > afaict).
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes.. my care of backwards branches is not quite related to the topic, I
> > > > > concerned that mostly because my test is using atomic operation, and I
> > > > > just want to test the exact asm code.
> > > > >
> > > > > > Anyway, all the problematic cases seem to arise when we start mixing
> > > > > > ACQUIRE/RELEASE accesses with relaxed accesses (i.e. where an access from
> > > > > > one group reads from an access in the other group). It would be simplest
> > > > > > to say that this doesn't provide any transitivity guarantees, and that
> > > > > > an ACQUIRE must always read from a RELEASE if transitivity is required.
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Agreed. RELEASE alone doesn't provide transitivity and transitivity is
> > > > ^^^^^^^
> > > > This should be ACQUIRE...
> > > >
> > > > > guaranteed only if an ACQUIRE read from a RELEASE. That's exactly the
> > > > > direction which the link (https://lkml.org/lkml/2015/9/15/836) is
> > > > > heading to. So I think we are fine here to use ctrl+isync here, right?
> > >
> > > We are going to have to err on the side of strictness, that is, having
> > > the documentation place more requirements on the developer than the union
> > > of the hardware does. Besides, I haven't heard any recent complaints
> > > that memory-barriers.txt is too simple. ;-)
> >
> > Agreed ;-)
> >
> > For atomic operations, using isync in ACQUIRE operations does gaurantee
> > that a pure RELEASE/ACQUIRE chain provides transitivity. So, again, I
> > think we are fine here to use isync in ACQUIRE atomic operations,
> > unless you think we need to be more strict, i.e, making ACQUIRE itself
> > provide transitivy?
>
> As I understand it, either isync or lwsync suffices, with the choice
> depending on the hardware. The kernel will rewrite itself at boot time
> if you use the appropriate macro. ;-)
>

Yep ;-)

Thank you and Will both for your comments. To be honest, I just began to
learn about these transitivity and cumulativity things recently. That's
a lot of fun to discuss these with you, Peter and Will, and the
herdtools you suggested and the N2745 document you wrote really helped a
lot. Thank you again!

Regards,
Boqun
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