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    SubjectRE: kernel support for non-English user messages
    Hi Robert.

    > Actually, my final point had been that doing it inside the kernel
    > itself, or indeed inside klogd, was probably a very bad idea. If
    > the translation always happens after-the-fact based on properly
    > harvested message semantics then any segment of messages
    > distributed into this mailing list (among other uses) would be
    > A) Still in English.
    > B) Translatable after the fact there too.
    > Also after-the-fact translation makes the language translations a
    > scalar problem instead of a matrix one. That is, if you always
    > pass the message stream around in English (treat it like n opaque
    > source file) and then translate it as necessary, it will "always
    > work".
    > If you try to do the translations at message generation time, then
    > the translation must be any-language-to-any-language capable during
    > post-even discussions. Not good.

    I can see the points you're making, and that is precisely why I believe
    that message codes would be required to implement this idea. As Linus
    has vetoed the idea of having message codes in the kernel, I can't see
    it ever coming to fruition.

    > Also, you will always have leakage as people add new strings to the
    > set.

    That's the easiest aspect of dealing with it - the tool that generates
    the language set to use just grabs the "English" language version for
    any message codes not in the selected translation.

    > As for the #define issues, when you process the source tree to build the
    > source matrix you just "gcc -E file.c | collector" and now the printk
    > case you mention is handled. Any module designer who does uglier things
    > can make a dead-code procedure that expresses his possible output strings
    > for collection (if he cares.)

    > {Satire}

    > Speaking as an arrogant (U.S. of) American who knows that God(TradeMark,
    > all rights reserved) decreed that he never had to learn any language but
    > his own, I can honestly state, that it is nearly certain that you will
    > get no real support for the multi-language kernel out of a us
    > We can't even get ourselves to write decent comments, and on the average,
    > we all secretly believe that if we just speak slowly enough everybody
    > really knows English. After all, that's how our condescending "wouldn't
    > want to fail Johnny, it would be bad for his self-image" public schools
    > taught us in the first place.... 8-)

    Speaking as an amused (U.S. of) American, I long ago learned how to tell
    somebody is speaking "God's Language"(tm) - that's simple to work out. After
    all, the most likely people to speak "God's Language"(tm) are those that
    just left His presence - the new born babies - so if we want to listen to
    language, we just listen to them speak it. What could be simpler???

    However, I understand "God's Language"(tm) is not currently understood well
    enough by the kernel developers for any of them to translate the kernel
    messages into it...

    > {/Satire}

    Best wishes from Riley.
    * Nothing as pretty as a smile, nothing as ugly as a frown.

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