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    SubjectRe: [LONG RANT] Re: Linux stifles innovation... (Felix von Leitner) writes:

    >Thus spake Henning P . Schmiedehausen (
    >> "If a company does not write a driver which works on all hardware
    >> platforms in all cases and gives us the source, then it is better,
    >> that the company writes no drivers at all."

    >> "If I can't force a company to write a driver for everyone, then I
    >> don't want to write them any driver at all."

    >> IMHO you're like a spoiled kid: "If I can't have it, noone should have it".

    >Henning, what is the matter with you?

    The matter with me is: "Vendors AAA ships its hardware product with a
    driver for i386/Linux". The driver may be closed source, but at least
    there _is_ a driver. Russell now says: "This is bad, because I can't use
    the driver for my ARM box. So the vendor should ship no driver at
    all. This is better than a i386-only driver".

    I say "I'm happy that there is _ANY_ driver at all. Because the vendor
    has recognized the importance of Linux at least on i386. And if they
    did this and they see, that they _can_ get market share, maybe they
    will start thinking about releasing for other architectures, too. Or
    even release the source to their driver".

    And if someone wants a driver for the hardware of vendor AAA on ARM
    and vendor AAA does decide _not_ to release the product for ARM, it is
    their right to do so.

    And Russell may still approach AAA to release an ARM driver, too. Or
    buy a product from BBB, which does support ARM with either a
    vendor-supported close source driver or an open source driver.

    Someone approached Legato to release a MIPS/Linux version of their
    backup client. Maybe they even paid for the port. And now, everyone
    can get this client from the Legato website. It is still closed
    source, but still, everyone that has a MIPS/Linux box benefited from

    >I bought the hardware. Why should I pay for the driver?

    If the hardware is "NOT SUPPORTED BESIDES LINUX/i386" and you have an
    ARM, the solution is simple: DON'T BUY IT. VOTE WITH YOUR MONEY. If
    Linux/ARM starts becoming a sigificant part of the market share,
    vendor AAA will either lose to vendor BBB or release a driver for ARM.

    >Please state your intentions. Why would you want to split the Linux
    >user base into people who pay companies to screw them (I get a driver
    >for hardware I already paid for, but the driver will work with exactly
    >one kernel version on one hardware) and people who think they deserve
    >support when they buy hardware?

    If you buy a hardware and on the box is stated "Supported on Windows,
    MacOS and Linux/i386" and you have none of these platforms, why buy
    it? If you buy it and then start complaining "it is not vendor-
    supported on Linux/ARM", it is your fault and not the fault of the
    vendor. If the vendor puts a second box next to the hardware box on
    the shelves, which just contains a CD-ROM with a binary only driver
    for Linux/ARM and sells this box for $99, it's their right to do
    so. And Russell can buy a vendor supported driver for Linux/ARM.

    >Why do we even have to discuss drivers?
    >A company that actively hinders developing a good driver with patents,
    >NDAs or other legal crap does not deserve my money. If you throw your
    >money at such people, you deserve everything you get.

    That's exactly my point. Nice to see, that we agree. ;-) See
    above. Vote with your money. But IMHO it's better to get
    vendor-supported drivers for Linux/i386, than no driver at
    all. Because if these drivers do not work, I _can_ call the company
    and complain.

    And I actively _DON'T_ want _YOU_ to decide what _I_ want. If I can
    get a driver for the hardware XXX that I need for a project and vendor
    AAA sells me a driver for this product on Linux only for a certain
    platform, kernel version and distribution, it is _MY_ _PERSONAL_
    _DECISION_ to still buy this driver or not. I don't want anyone to
    tell me "you must not do this, because it's bad". If it's bad or not,
    please let me decide. I'm old enough to decide for myself.

    I WANT THE CHOICE. If I have no choice, I buy the product on another

    And you can be sure, I will not come running to LKM to complain and
    demand support.

    And you can even sue if you're in Germany and the driver does not work
    as stated on the box("Erfüllung zugesicherter Eigenschaften, Nach-
    besserung oder Wandlung").


    P.S.: I consider "configuring a mailer so that it does not accept mail
    from a sender" neither good style nor "das letzte Wort" in a discussion.
    It is IMHO a sign of weakness and inability to discuss on an objective
    base. It is more like "I don't like your opinion, so I censor you".
    Discussion, Microsoft-style.

    Dipl.-Inf. (Univ.) Henning P. Schmiedehausen -- Geschaeftsfuehrer
    INTERMETA - Gesellschaft fuer Mehrwertdienste mbH

    Am Schwabachgrund 22 Fon.: 09131 / 50654-0
    D-91054 Buckenhof Fax.: 09131 / 50654-20
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