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    SubjectRe: Fork Bombing Patch
    Anand Jahagirdar wrote:
    > Hi
    > consider a case:
    > if non root user request admin for more number of processes than root
    > user,admin needs to modify settings in /etc/security/limits.conf file
    > and if that user is not trustworthy and if does fork bombing attack it
    > will kill the box.

    If root is dumb enough to give the user whatever privileges they ask for,
    fork-bombing is the least of your problems.

    > (I have already tried this attack). in that case this loop will work,
    > but by the time attack might have killed the box (Bcoz so many
    > processes has already been created at that time) . so in that case
    > admin wont come to know that what has happened.

    On large multi-user SMP systems, the default ulimits will keep the box
    responsive, if sluggish. Perhaps you should file a bug with your distribution
    if you believe the default settings in limits.conf are too high. There's no way
    to algorithmically distinguish a forkbomb from a legitimate highly-threaded

    > Like this there are many cases..(actually these cases has already been
    > discussed On LKML 2 months before in my thread named "fork bombing
    > attack").
    > in all these cases this printk helps adminstrator a lot.

    What exactly does this patch help the administrator do? If a box is thrashing,
    you still have sysrq. You can also use cpusets and taskset to put your root
    login session on a dedicated processor, which is getting to be pretty cheap on
    modern many-core, many-thread systems. Group scheduling is in the oven, which
    will allow you to prioritize classes of users in a more general manner, even on
    UP systems.

    > On 8/29/07, Simon Arlott <> wrote:
    >> On Wed, August 29, 2007 10:48, Anand Jahagirdar wrote:
    >>> Hi
    >>> printk_ratelimit function takes care of flooding the
    >>> syslog. due to printk_ratelimit function syslog will not be flooded

    Um, no. printk_ratelimit is on the order of *seconds*. This prevents error
    conditions from causing the system to spend all of its CPU and I/O time logging.
    It does very little to prevent log spamming. If I sent you an email every
    second, it would make it much more difficult for you to find other messages in
    your inbox. It's possible (easy, even) to write a forkbomber that doesn't
    actually harm system responsiveness, but will still trigger this printk as fast
    as possible. If we merge this patch, every cracking toolkit in existence will
    add such a feature, because log spamming makes it harder for the administrator
    to find more important messages, and even if the administrator uses grep
    judiciously to filter them out, that doesn't help if logrotate has already
    deleted the log containing the information they need to keep /var/log from
    filling up.

    >>> anymore. as soon as administrator gets this message, he can take
    >>> action against that user (may be block user's access on server). i
    >>> think the my fork patch is very useful and helps administrator lot.

    You still haven't explained why this can't be done in userspace. If forkbombing
    is a serious threat (and it's not) you can run a forkbomb monitor with realtime
    priority that won't be severely impacted by thrashing among normal priority
    processes. Userspace has room for much more sophisticated processing anyway, so
    doing this in the kernel doesn't make much sense.

    >>> i would also like to mention that in some of the cases
    >>> ulimit solution wont work. in that case fork bombing takes the machine
    >>> and server needs a reboot. i am sure in that situation this printk
    >>> statement helps administrator to know what has happened.

    SysRq-t makes it quite obvious that the system has been forkbombed, allowing the
    administrator to lower ulimits if the box can't handle the load permitted by the
    default settings. Sometimes SysRq is inconvenient due to lack of physical
    access, which is why I wrote hangwatch[1].

    Hangwatch monitors /proc/loadavg and writes the specified set of SysRq triggers
    into /proc/sysrq-trigger when the specified load average is exceeded, with the
    specified frequency. It doesn't require forks or dynamic memory allocation, so
    it works basically any time the box isn't locked up enough to trigger NMI
    watchdog, though realtime users may want to run it with chrt priority. It's
    very simple, but it's proven so effective that there really hasn't been much
    need to develop it further since I initially wrote it a year ago.

    Given how much we can already do in userspace, I don't really see a need to
    implement this in the kernel. If you'd like me to add features to hangwatch,
    let's talk about that. You can even fork it yourself, since it's GPL.

    -- Chris

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      Last update: 2007-08-29 15:51    [W:0.025 / U:7.868 seconds]
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