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SubjectRe: 20 years without semantic innovation is enough
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Amen Pavel!!!

Jeff


----- Original Message -----
From: Pavel Machek <pavel@bug.ucw.cz>
To: Hans Reiser <reiser@ceic.com>; David S. Miller <davem@redhat.com>
Cc: <pongheng@starnet.gov.sg>; <linux-kernel@vger.rutgers.edu>;
<reiserfs@devlinux.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 1999 2:56 PM
Subject: Re: 20 years without semantic innovation is enough

> Hi!
>
> > My point though is that the file system semantics have been static for
> > 20 years. It is time for them to change. When they change NFS will
>
> Why?
>
> brake is in the middle in all cars for 20 years. Lets move it to the
> right.
>
> See?
>
> I do not see a reason why to introduce directory-looks-like-file thing
> that will break everything.
>
> Yes I see why #iwannaseethisdirectoryasafile suffix would be usefull
> for turning directories into files.
>
> Just don't allow me to do cat /usr/src/linux and get .tar file. I did
> not request it. However cat /usr/src/linux#tar and getting tar file is
> acceptable (and will not break anything).
>
> You'll confuse users, and you'll confuse them _badly_. What is find /
> -type f expected to print?
>
> Ok, doing some tricks with modifying times of directories when its
> subdirs are accessed may make sense. (And I believe it would be pretty
> innocent.) Doing cat on directory and getting some file in
> it. Well. It might be acceptable, also. But what do you think tools
> like emacs or less will do? They will not even try to open it -
> because they _know_ it is directory.
>
> I think that going with suffixes is much better/easier. You want to
> see directory as #tar file? Just add suffix. Emacs will
> stat("/etc#tar"), see that it is file, and behave accordingly.
>
> If you try to do it so that open("/etc") works - it will not help
> you. Emacs will stat() it first (because it knows about directories -
> try it), and then open it in directory mode, anyway.
>
> Pavel
> PS: Take avfs. It makes it easy for you to try almost any semantic
> changes (if you preload it). You'll not destroy your system this
> way. Try your changes. Learn that they do not work. I did play this
> way. Applications are much too clever. What do you think emacs will do
> when you emacs ftp://bug/etc/passwd? open
> ( "/home/pavel/ftp:/bug/etc/passwd" ). And so on.
> --
> I'm really pavel@ucw.cz. Look at http://195.113.31.123/~pavel. Pavel
> Hi! I'm a .signature virus! Copy me into your ~/.signature, please!
>
> -
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